Thursday, September 25, 2008

Guess I touched a nerve.....

So my good buds over at the Calgarypuck forum have cited me with another infraction and completely pulled a thread I started about Mr. Prentice and his special sign privileges.

Reason: While an interesting discussion topic, the forum isn't a place to link to your own blog so overtly like that.
The moderator went on to say;
Posting a thread with the subject matter without a link would have been great.

Well I can't deny it; yes, posting links to my blog is to drive traffic to it.
Isn't that why we all blog? To get the word out to as many people as possible?
Isn't that why we post on forums? To share, discuss and debate ideas?

It is the same reason I have a link on my blog to their site....
to drive traffic to them.

They say that posting the entire blog entry would have been more appropriate; however I am pretty sure it would have gathered just as many complaints and likely also led to an infraction.

And this all seems rather ironic, since the first infraction I received in January was this one:


Violation of copyright, do not repost entire articles. Please read the posted guidelines.
Granted I can see the difference between my own articles and those of others.
None the less, I have been using that as a guideline in subsequent postings.... in fact there have been two other threads that I started in exactly this same fashion.

http://forum.calgarypuck.com/showthread.php?t=54916

http://forum.calgarypuck.com/showthread.php?t=61627

I did not receive an infraction on either of those; nor were the threads pulled.

Clearly they are being selective about what gets debated; fair enough it is their board to do as they see fit. I will stick to boards that apply their own guidelines fairly and equally.

6 comments:

  1. I guess since this discussion is to be public...

    "Well I can't deny it; yes, posting links to my blog is to drive traffic to it."

    By leveraging others' hard work without their permission and when their rules ask to not do it?

    How much fun would a forum be when its overrun by spammers who aren't interested in discussion all posting links to their own sites? There are sites like Digg and Reddit that are great for what you describe.

    "It is the same reason I have a link on my blog to their site....
    to drive traffic to them."

    And it's appreciated. We also allow you to link your blog in every single post you make. There's hundreds of links to your blog from the CP forum.

    On your blog you control the content of the blog and the links. In a forum there's thousands of people constantly contributing content.

    As I said, the focus on CP is hockey and discussion, if we allowed everyone to promote their own sites that would dilute what we'd like to see on the forum.

    "They say that posting the entire blog entry would have been more appropriate; however I am pretty sure it would have gathered just as many complaints and likely also led to an infraction."

    Your post didn't generate any complaints, I saw it. And it being likely to lead to an infraction is pure speculation on your part.

    "Granted I can see the difference between my own articles and those of others."

    Glad you agree.

    "I did not receive an infraction on either of those; nor were the threads pulled.

    Clearly they are being selective about what gets debated; fair enough it is their board to do as they see fit. I will stick to boards that apply their own guidelines fairly and equally."

    With thousands of posts every day, not every single post gets moderated with a fine tooth comb. If no one reports a post and no moderator notices it then how is it to be moderated?

    The moderators volunteer their personal time and do a great job of being as fair and equal as they can. They sometimes spend hours discussing actions trying to ensure that the best decision is made.

    In this case you mention you had posted those threads previously.. Possibly the first few were seen as one offs and not really an issue but if it became a common thing then a polite note to ask that the rules be observed was in order?

    To insinuate that we're trying to decide what gets debated is laughable. Who has time for that kind of micro-management?? I even offered to reinstate the thread, that disproves that notion.

    The reality is that people try to do the best they can.

    You're making a mountain out of a mole hill.

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  2. If it is a mole hill why bother coming to my blog to comment on it.

    I have posted on several forums for a few years now. I don’t envy the task of being a moderator one bit. It is a thankless job.

    If I simply posted links without commentary; that would be spam. I don’t do that.

    If I simply posted blog excerpts without further comment and only gave further attention to my blog comments; that would be shameless self promotion. I don’t do this either.

    I stick around the forum to discuss, debate and elaborate on comments. Often and particularly with the puck forum, I put up with a great deal of abuse; sometimes very personal abuse.

    So, yes I get my defenses up bit when something I have done, is fine one day and not the next.

    And yes, it annoys me that if I were to post about another person’s blog entry the expectation is that I only post a portion of it and then link to give them credit and traffic, yet I can’t do the same for myself.

    I guess I had hoped that I had would have gotten a private message from you pointing out the finer points of the moderators expectation; rather then receiving a lifetime infraction and having the thread completely disappear.

    I know you offered to reinstate the thread….. guess I am just stubborn. I don’t feel it appropriate for me to be making that decision at this point. You can do whatever you please with the thread.

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  3. "If I simply posted links without commentary; that would be spam. I don’t do that.

    If I simply posted blog excerpts without further comment and only gave further attention to my blog comments; that would be shameless self promotion. I don’t do this either.

    I stick around the forum to discuss, debate and elaborate on comments."

    Which is why we didn't ban you as a spammer; because you're not.

    It's just a question of what's appropriate. And sometimes that might be a moving target; not all situations are easily compared. Your first two threads had specific circumstances around them (an election, and serious subject matter) which also makes them more difficult to judge.

    This isn't a case of trying to single you out, it's a case of what your doing being almost unique and trying to find the right balance.

    As I said you're not a spammer, but if we let the forum fill up with every Joe who started a hockey website pimping their own site, we wouldn't be able to see our own content. It'd still look like tons of spam.

    Plus people pay to advertise on the site, to drive eyeballs to their site from CP. To let other people "advertise" for free decreases the value for those that pay.

    So from all that the balance I thought of was to have the entire thought posted wholesale (not just a link to a blog entry). That way you can discuss the topic (which people will enjoy), and it keeps the "no self promotion" side of the rules happy. I don't see what's so evil about that.

    "I guess I had hoped that I had would have gotten a private message from you pointing out the finer points of the moderators expectation; rather then receiving a lifetime infraction and having the thread completely disappear."

    Well for the infraction, maybe the term infraction is a bit imposing, but honestly that's all an infraction is, is a PM from the moderator institutionalized. The infraction system simply allows us to keep track of those PMs in a record. Yes its permanent, but that way you don't get 3 moderators PMing you over the same thing since all mods (and only mods) can see it. It also lets us track habitual users, with 7000+ members it's tough to remember who did what sometimes. With infractions if someone has a pattern of some sort of behaviour it's quickly visible.

    "I know you offered to reinstate the thread….. guess I am just stubborn. I don’t feel it appropriate for me to be making that decision at this point. You can do whatever you please with the thread."

    I'm as stubborn as the best of them, I know because my 4 year old son reflects it right back at me! :D

    I know I and others find your posts interesting and worth having on the forum.. if I didn't care I wouldn't have given your comments the time and thought I have. I hope I've communicated the why behind what we did/do.

    I'll reinstate the thread and edit the initial post to have the full content of your blog entry.

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  4. Yes, you have expressed and explained the moderators position very clearly and with respect; which I appreciate.

    Thank you Photon.

    :)

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  5. Both of you are dorks and should spend your time doing other things.

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  6. ... this coming from someone who spends their time reading the dorks comments....LOL

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